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How the Gaming Ecosystem is Approaching Growth in 2023

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The bottom line

Gaming growth in 2023 runs on aggregated data, so teams trust SKAN and MMP together, move budget fast and test many tools. Winning now depends on strong creative and real marketing, not on machine-learning targeting.

Key takeaways

  • Apple's privacy rules took away user-level data and changed how gaming teams buy iOS traffic. 2:14
    • Hitting the SKAN conversion thresholds in every campaign is hard, and retargeting is no longer possible.
    • SKAN only covers the first 24 to 48 hours, which is a poor fit for games that optimize for long-term returns.
  • Teams respond by moving budget between networks and channels much faster. 3:41
    • Not every ad network moved well into SKAN, so money goes to wherever the return is best.
    • Teams also test new channels that are quicker to adapt to SKAN.
  • SKAN is the source of truth, but it is read together with MMP data. 8:40
    • SKAN and probabilistic matching show big gaps, even when the install threshold is met.
    • Networks that offer dual attribution views give marketers more to decide with.
  • Top-down tools like media mix modeling and CTV give a useful big picture, but they are slow. 10:48
    • Media mix models can run several months behind, so they are hard for a UA team to act on.
    • CTV is not a Sprint it's a marathon, and smaller companies struggle to sustain the spend.
  • As targeting and measurement shrink, UA turns into real marketing built on strong creative. 7:43
    • Android's Sandbox is expected to bring a similar loss of control soon.
    • The classic ad of hook, gameplay and call to action is still the top performer, and teams iterate on its middle segment.

Sometimes it's going back to the essence of actually doing marketing and doing good products, getting great ads.

Omer Gerzon, Play Studios

Chapter summaries

0:00 Privacy changes the audience and the measurement

Losing hyper targeting widened the iOS audience, and measurement became the harder problem than budget.

  • Creative on iOS got harder to judge. 3:12
    • Teams see less about which creatives work.
    • The iOS audience is far wider than before.
    • The cause is the loss of hyper targeting capabilities.
    • At first SKAN was a shock, and teams then learned to work with it.
  • Measurement is the main struggle, and schemas are the key. 4:22
    • Budget allocation within iOS changed a little. Measurement changed most.
    • Play Studios spent months optimizing its schemas to measure performance better.
    • Rebecca says her overall marketing mix has not changed drastically.
    • Her team tests new channels instead of leaving the mix alone.

4:43 Building SKAN schemas and waiting for 4.0

A schema decides what SKAN can show, and SKAN 4.0 may help but is adopted slowly.

  • A schema packs user behavior into aggregated data points. 4:43
    • With no user-level data, reporting must be built from aggregated points.
    • Schemas can track buckets of revenue, different events and different user levels.
    • Some teams use binary coding to fit more into the limited signal.
    • Omer says you are a bit blind in how you build it.
  • SKAN 4.0 moves in the right direction, but few have adopted it. 5:46
    • Adoption is improving, but publishers and advertisers have not fully switched.
    • Apple is trying to give performance marketers more visibility and transparency.
    • The new windows are one in the first 72 hours and another after a week.
    • Omer is less excited than the others. All agree measurement will not go back to how it was.

7:29 Less targeting, more marketing

When models and measurement give less, teams must be precise about the marketing itself.

  • Without machine learning to find users, teams must be precise. 8:16
    • Success cannot rest on models that just find the right users.
    • Activities need to be measured holistically.
    • The panelist calls for real ads, not fake ones.
    • The shift can feel scary at first.
  • Top-down measurement is used only where bottom-up data is weak. 9:42
    • Play Studios does not run media mix modeling at the moment.
    • It measures incrementality for branding and offline activities.
    • Influencer marketing is harder to measure and needs honest uplift readings.
    • Margarita is the panelist more advanced in influencer marketing.

10:15 Testing a mix of measurement tools

No single model gives the full picture, so teams test MMM, MMPs and incrementality platforms together.

  • The right setup is a mix of tools, and teams are still testing it. 11:38
    • An internal MMM model already helps drive some decisions.
    • Nobody has a proven recipe yet, but testing is the safer path into the privacy-first future.
    • MMM is most useful for channels outside traditional user acquisition.
    • The team is also building incrementality and seasonality reports, and expects to improve them.
  • CTV is hard to measure because it is not direct response. 12:34
    • There are no directly attributed clicks or installs to judge it by.
    • The same holds for influencer marketing, so campaigns must keep running.
    • The lesson is to keep momentum even when users show no direct reaction.
    • The open question is how to build the spend up over time.

13:31 Social features and referrals

Organic growth from social features depends on the genre, and cheap creator content helps where it doesn't.

  • Social features work best in games that are social by nature. 14:07
    • Pop Slots lets players invite others to play together.
    • Monopoly Go is highly viral because its play is tied to PVP with real players.
    • Tetris has no such feature yet, but PVP is planned.
    • Stumble Guys is described as the peak of virality.
    • Some genres are less prone to going viral by default.
  • Spark ads and collaborations turn creator content into cheap ads. 15:07
    • Rebecca searches TikTok for UGC that already promotes the app and asks the creator to run it as a Spark ad.
    • Followers, likes and comments go to the brand page, so the ad is free and the creator gets engagement.
    • The team also uses the collaboration feature on Instagram.
    • It works best for brands that already have people talking about them.
  • Referrals are tracked through links built into the game. 17:12
    • Players invite friends over WhatsApp or the phone's share sheet.
    • Some games use deep linking on these invites.
    • SMS has not been tried.

18:16 Apple Search Ads

Apple Search Ads is a premium channel that is easy to use on brand terms and hard to scale beyond them.

  • Brand keywords perform best, and growth beyond them is hard. 18:31
    • It is more expensive than other channels, but more premium.
    • Games with famous brands like Marvel, Star Trek or Tetris can simply target those terms.
    • Bidding on your own brand is called the creme de la creme, though some of those installs might have come anyway.
    • It also protects the brand from competitors trying to outbid it.
  • Custom product pages on competitor keywords can work. 19:14
    • Opera runs custom product pages against rivals like Chrome and Firefox, with good results.
    • Competitive keywords are where the extra challenge begins.
    • Many advertisers use custom product pages to lift performance on certain keywords.

20:31 Cheap installs and Facebook under SKAN

Odd niches can still give very cheap installs, while Facebook results under SKAN must be judged by one source of truth.

  • Apple Search Ads on mispronounced brand names gave very low CPI. 20:45
    • A founder of a travel assistant app targeted airlines whose names people often say wrong.
    • It worked in certain geos.
    • He targeted the smaller airlines too.
    • The CPI was "ridiculously low", and the success surprised the speaker.
  • Optimizing Facebook for purchases pushes CPI up, so results need an outside check. 22:02
    • Facebook has grown expensive over the past few years.
    • Purchase optimization has to cross SKAN thresholds, which takes more spend.
    • Measure with SKAN or the MMP, not the platform's own numbers, on any channel.
    • Nobody on the panel relies on in-platform Facebook or Firebase installs.

22:57 Google UA

Google is strong for lower-funnel optimization, but it is automated and gives little control over creative.

  • Google has nailed lower-funnel event optimization. 23:32
    • It is a great source of Android traffic, and iOS is improving.
    • tROAS bidding for SKAN is in beta.
    • Optimizing off Firebase gave a clear uplift, even though the MMP data is the same.
    • It is not true for every title, but it holds statistically.
  • The creative mix is mostly out of the marketer's hands, but some patterns hold. 24:53
    • Spend splits between search, video and display differently in each game.
    • Longer videos have a better chance of winning YouTube inventory.
    • Search often brings the best quality and lowest CPI, so ad copy matters a lot.
    • Her ranking is video, then copy, then banners. Static ads matter less but still feed search and the display network.

26:32 Top tactics: creative, UGC and community

The simple classic ad and authentic content from real people still beat clever tricks.

  • Hook, gameplay and call to action is still the winning ad. 27:04
    • Teams iterate on the middle segment of the video.
    • Influencers are hard to track, so their payoff is unproven.
    • One test is different ways to judge players inside fake gameplay.
    • A better influencer program is the focus, though it is not yet the most effective tactic.
  • Real player content performs differently from staged UGC. 28:06
    • Some platforms supply actors who simulate UGC.
    • Asking real players to make videos, then turning them into ads, also worked.
    • UGC itself has been around for years.
  • Community content that gives value before selling builds a loyal audience. 29:12
    • Cookware brand Our Place grew from zero to about 600,000 followers in a couple of years.
    • It reportedly used no online ads.
    • It made recipe videos with chefs, with the pans in the middle of them.
    • It now has a brand partnership with Selena Gomez.

In the growth library

Margarita Vasilevski, Omer Gerzon, Rebecca Caulkins (moderated by Steve P. Young), Margarita: VP of Performance Marketing at Scopely; Omer: head of performance teams at Playtika-style studio Play Studios; Rebecca: UA Manager at Pixelberry Studios. Three mobile gaming growth leaders explain how they handle SKAN, measurement across MMP, SKAN and MMM, Apple Search Ads, Google UA and organic channels after ATT. Their practical takeaways include treating SKAN as the source of truth, investing steadily in non-direct-response channels, and building ads around the classic hook, gameplay, call to action structure.

Lessons that draw on this:

More from App Masters · The whole library, and ask it anything

Transcript765 lines
0:03

I'm gonna do something fun right now we're gonna have some audience participation as well so get ready for the slido but I'm going to introduce every single person because it's pretty cool to come into some music you know what I'm saying so here we go she is the VP of Performance Marketing at scopely where she oversees the Performance Marketing teams on the strategy side of scope police portfolio which includes games like Star Trek Fleet command and Marvel Strike Force give a round of applause for margarita but still let's keep sorry Margarita give it around Applause come on guys did I tell them all right next up he manages all the performance teams of play Studios an award-winning developer of free to play casual games and social claims including the official Tetris game and hit Casino titles like pop slots my Vegas slots and the official MGM slots give a round Applause for omergerson oh man

1:11

[Applause] and last but not certainly least she oversees all the UA activities of pixel varies pixelberry Studios hit games choices she is the UA manager at pixelberry Studios one more round of applause for Rebecca Calkins [Applause]

1:44

all right I've been told not to hit this button too many times so I'm just gonna do it once but if you guys want to ask some questions go ahead and put your questions up there we'll be answering them I got them right on my phone so ask away all right let's kick it off Rebecca sits you right next to me we're talking a lot about privacy and stuff how has that impacted the way that you guys do UA and Market yeah so um it's definitely impacted a lot I think everyone can agree to that um just in general trying to hit the scan conversion thresholds in every single one of our campaigns has been difficult we're not able to do retargeting um but yeah I think there's a lot of impact on retargeting as well mainly on iOS and I think the the first time it was a bit of a shock about how you and those scan about how you work with this thing yeah and eventually um we all learned to work with that right um no absolutely the uh traffic mix uh

2:49

has changed quite a lot not all of the uh ad networks and partners were able to successfully transition into the scan ecosystem and framework some of them are doing better some of them are doing a little bit worse right so we as a team have to adjust and move funds where we're getting the best return on investment on our end also I can highlight that the creative part on iOS has become more challenging right because we're getting less visibility into the creatives that are working as well as the audience on iOS has become way wider because we lost the hyper targeting capabilities um so yeah that's that's my as a marketing mix changed at all like where you focused on certain platforms and now you moved away from them I say I think oh sorry but I think for us um our marketing mix honestly hasn't changed drastically we have definitely been trying out some new channels that have been um quicker to Pivot with the whole scan

3:50

situation um but also we are moving our budget away from we're more consistently switching our budget from platform or from channel to channel a lot quicker than we were before I would say and also we're just constantly trying to test out new channels that are working with this type of thing I think an inbox a little about the way that we allocate budget within iOS um but mainly it impacts the way that we measure things and I think the main the main struggle or the main challenge that we have and I think the key to success with scan is work on on your schemas yeah and and this is uh been a great work that we did over the past few months here to to optimize our schemas to to be able to to measure our performance better the way scan works is is is that you don't have the the actual user level data right so uh you need to build a schema of reporting uh data points that is aggregated and then there is certain

5:02

ways to build that it's it's quite I would say encrypted or or the several ways to do that some are doing some binary coding around uh how reporting scan and and there is some ways to do that that that you can also track buckets of revenues or track different events and and track different levels of of users but you need to do it some someone you are a bit blind around what you're doing and it's only about the first 24 to 48 hours of the activity right right also and schema conversation what do you guys feel about the uh 4.0 opportunities and features because in my opinion again we are not practicing that widely it hasn't been adopted that much as you guys know the adoption rate is is getting better but it's not quite there for um uh the Publishers and advertisers to to fully switch but I think apple is moving in the right direction by trying to provide more visibility and transparency for performance marketers

6:16

to optimize right even the change from those 72 hours uh count down to what is the new one I think there's one in the first 72 hours and then another one after a week so yeah so scan until now is basically working just on the first 24 hours 48 hours it's very challenging for us in gaming to to measure that way because we are optimizing for long-term returns and and when we have the option we'll have the option on scan for 4.0 to measure beyond that so it should be more uh easy I wouldn't say easy but it should be more easy easier yeah um yeah but but it's it's not gonna be so armor is not as excited okay got it so five hours I'm not going to solve this okay it's not going to go back to us before right definitely yeah um I think I'm I think I'm more on your side I think it's gonna help definitely and I think it's we're definitely moving to the right direction but I'm wondering how much I'm wondering about the adoption rate

7:25

and when it's gonna like pick up and we can really start seeing the changes from it I think the way we talked about China mix the weight the way it's impacts is that when we lose control over measurement and we are going to do to have this similar situation I think in in Android soon with sandbox so the way the inbox is that we start to do less user acquisition and more marketing just marketing and being being able to measure our activities holistically yeah it's so scary to me sometimes scary but it's sometimes it's going back to the essence of actually doing marketing and doing good products getting great ads yeah real ads not fake ad real ads and and being and being uh being just good and not based just on on machine learning models that just find you the right users you need to be very precise about what you're doing I got a question from the audience on iOS are you looking at scan MMP problem

8:31

holistic scan reporting if a mix tips on making sense of these sources of Truth yeah that's a that's a really good question I think that um we always look for our company we always look at scan as our true source of data um pmatching has been great but at the same time it's we've had huge discrepancies between scan and P matching even when we're hitting the install threshold so that's been very difficult um but yeah definitely scan but looking at a mix of both I would say um same always both I think there are challenges with both of the attribution models but the more data uh performance marketer has the better decision we can make right I I love networks that can provide the Dual attribution dual view I just equips us a little bit more with the decision making more questions for you guys you guys ready for that yeah I like it keep them coming look I'm looking are you investing in top down measurement

9:32

incrementality lift measurement media mix modeling or do you marry or how do you marry it with your Bottoms Up attribution so media mix modeling it's not something that we do at the moment we do look at some activities we want to measure incrementality it's mainly in it's mainly around branding activities or offline activities uh I think margarita maybe more in um advancing influencer marketing that that it's more difficult to to measure and needs to be honest with the uh with uplifts right yeah well I could speak a little bit about that we are experimenting quite a lot right we're preparing for and we're already in the new reality with the Privacy first uh world we do experiment with mmm quite a lot we actually have an internal model that helps already helps Drive certain uh decisions and um conclusions uh there are some downsides of mmm I know guys there are so many different Logics and and the types of

10:44

mmm out there so I'm not going to speak to all of them obviously but um the challenges that mmm has in in my experience is that it's not very actionable for again for a UA team because it's it's a little bit behind like in certain in some cases it's several months behind for example right because the model needs to have a fully baked data to to Really spit out the results it is still great because on the big picture it can provide very precise uh like knowledge and and and and highlights in terms of the um effectiveness of particular channels or particular activities especially those that are outside of the uh traditional user acquisition channels um so I've seen success with that but I think uh for a real um for the right mix of tools that a company needs to use there has to be um a combination or Synergy of models like mmm and whatever else the performance marketers can still do with mmps with incrementality platforms there

11:52

are so many of them um we do experiment quite a lot with with that at the moment unfortunately don't have the you know the recipe for Success the right answer like hey this is this is how you need to do it but um I would highly recommend looking and trying and testing um because that's going to cure a safer transition into into the future things that were also internally working on some incrementality and like seasonality reports I do think that we have some ways to go but we will get there I'm happy to know that it has benefited you a lot do you think that um when you said some different types of channels that are not our normal channels have you tried CTV yet yes we did we did uh and it's not easy to measure it's not easy to measure and I think for all the activities that are not direct response it's harder to measure and I think the main learning that we learn around that is that it's

12:54

it's not a Sprint it's a marathon yeah so so you need to keep consisting although you don't see the direct uh reactions sometimes of users and you don't see the direct attributed clicked installs you need to keep the momentum going and keep the campaigns on on CTV on influences marketing and it's harder I think for smaller companies to to maintain this this amount of spend over time but but it's it's it's how how to build it over time yeah Rebecca you're a mind reader this was one of the questions the TV yeah oh my God I knew it all right let's talk about organic growth we got questions that came in one of the first questions so shout out to you thank you so much how do you what do you okay let me rephrase how do you think about okay what do you think about leveraging social features to drive organic growth like the tetris brand because we've got a question about the tetris brand too that just friends me

13:53

you go first time so what's question about the touch respect well let's let's go after this question how do you leverage social features to drive organic growth first and foremost social futures um I think uh um Human Social features in the apps sure uh so uh in Place Studios uh we have many many games that are more social in in their environment so you can actually if you play pop slots for example so you can invite people to play Slots uh but next to you so so there is there is this feature to to invite people to play with you together um it's not actually available yet in Tetris uh but there is some PVP plans for for that is as well um but what else choices see I remember now what about choices yeah so for um I kind of took that question in a different way so I might answer it in a different way um I thought it was referring to social features within um social platforms as in like with

15:03

influencer content I don't know if I'm is that what it was meant for but um we've been definitely utilizing the collaboration feature on Instagram recently and then also we've been doing a ton of spark ads on Tick Tock which is not necessarily organic but it is still a very interesting way to find content and be able to get the rights to videos with influencers and also like promote videos without having to spend the initial money to make the content than yourself so like if you're a brand name that already has people talking about you you might be able to search yourself up on Tick Tock and find some ugc content that's already made that's promoting your app so you could message them and say hey do you want to run a spark ad all of the followers likes comments will go to your page most of the time they're like yes then you get an ad for free they get some engagement and then everybody's happy it's free yeah so

16:03

we've been really enjoying that feature on Tick Tock recently and then also collaborations on Instagram but we are a little behind when it comes to the social connectivity of choices but we're gonna get there well the answer is yes uh the games that I work closely with Star Trek Marvel uh there are less social elements of what Rebecca and Omar are talking about but um we have a lot of games in our portfolio we have Monopoly gold that just launched recently the game is highly viral and the gameplay is is basically tied to you know interacting with uh with basically PVP right with the with the real players so we have a game like stumble guys that is like the peak of virality and uh it's like a very very known title um uh so yeah I mean the answer is yes but it really depends on the genre because certain genres are I'm not saying that we shouldn't try to make it viral with with in-game features but I

17:01

think just by defaults are in genres are a little bit less prone to that are you guys using any referral programs and then if you are how do you measure if it's a successful one refer programs so uh as I as I shared there is some features around uh inviting friends and then it's trackable with with the links that we have implemented in the game uh so this is how we did is it just sharing with friends like they hit that little share button text it out yeah it's something that you for example can invite a friend over WhatsApp directly from the game to come and play with you in the same room so uh so this is are you doing any deep linking on that um for some games yes okay and who I've actually seen that you know WhatsApp SMS messaging probably the best referral like I think a lot of people talk about social I haven't share it on social but the best engagement really comes from SMS is that still true

17:59

um we we're not trying SMS actually but but there's just a feature to send you know send the link wherever you want with with you know when you click share an iPhone and then you can share it wherever you can share it on Facebook on on your feed if you want just come come and play with me on pop slots you guys want to move to the Apple search ads yeah no okay all right for iOS Apple search ads Apple native channel does not use scan which allows you to track data more accurately any thoughts on how you can use this channel better um so so I think it's obviously that that's Apple search has grown over the past year uh go for FL this move on on measurement um so I think uh Apple searches is also challenging because it's I think a more expensive Channel but it's a more premium channel um the way to grow it I think outside the brands it's it might be easier for uh for games that have famous Brands like Marvel or Star Trek

19:05

or or Tetris to just you know Target this keyword and I think that the the way to expand it uh is more challenging um a custom product produces something that's fairly new and and many advertisers utilized it to to improve performance over certain keywords Yeah we actually see competitor brands do pretty well and using custom there's a slide where's Emory from mobile action there he is like he if you like search for Opera right Opera Chrome Firefox and then you have who's the brand Opera Opera is a brand that's running yeah Opera is the one that's running custom project pages on some of their competitors we've seen pretty good success on that anybody else wanna Margarita you want to add in yeah yeah I can I can add a little bit yeah of course we utilize Apple search ads in terms of scalability that's a little tricky right and I think it's not not a secret that apple storage performs extremely well especially if you have an

20:00

AP game or the game with the with the known IP already and when you're bidding on your own brand terms this is the creme de La Creme right um I mean it can be questionable a little bit contradicting because uh would you get those installs if you weren't bidding maybe yes maybe no but also you are protecting your brand right from the other advertisers trying to outbid you now when it comes to going after the competitive keywords or anything like that that's where you know you see a little bit more challenge with the consistent performance but I have a great case study from a friend of mine he is outside of gaming uh he had an app I'm not going to promote it um oh man for various reasons but uh the interesting in that app was uh in the aviation so basically like an assistant for travel frequent Travelers and the guy was the founder and he cracked the code basically when he was doing Apple search ads he found

21:01

um like in certain GEOS you basically found the airline companies like very popular maybe smaller ones but when they're being frequently mispronounced you know so he was going out after those like mispronounced terms and he was actually driving like ridiculously low CPI out of apple search ads so that was like one of the unique uh really great success cases that I really saw in action that was like astonishing to me so I I think there are a lot of opportunities um but uh in terms of like the actual you know what what the advertisers have to work with right now um um I think there are some challenges here and there you know this is actually a question questions are coming in thank you so much this is crazy okay on scan specifically for Facebook ads is optimizing for conversion events reliable since there's too little data to work with is it better to optimize for installs I think it depends on on what you your

21:59

target is it's I think Facebook have gone we know all that Facebook have gone very expensive over the past year or or two years three years and the deal with scanners that you need to cross the thresholds now if you optimize to to to conversions or to purchases so it makes your your CPI super high and then you need to invest a lot of money if it's reliable or not you need to measure it with scan and not rely on on the data that you see on the platform well on neither of on any channel not on Facebook not on Google no you need to trust your one source of truth if it's the m p or scan and I don't think that anyone here works with I don't know the Facebook installs or the Firebase installs inside the platform to to rely on that as the installs but yeah okay on time what about Google you kind of mentioned a little bit anybody doing anything on Google UA yeah of course yeah of course just do it

23:06

all of course have you guys seen that be more effective than Facebook any tips optimize introverts installs rather than down funnel events sorry did you say what are your thoughts it's pretty curious to hear you yeah no Google Google is fantastic uh really great um I think they um they have really nailed down the um you know the down funnel like lower funnel event optimization uh they're a great source of Android traffic on iOS obviously not not a secret it's a little bit more it is getting right so they're rolling out new features such as chiros bidding for uh scan uh it's on beta right now um so they're going into the right direction um obviously we did see a really great uh uplift in performance after switching uh to Firebase um I don't know guys if you had the same experience with that again this is not like news news that's something that happened like several years ago but optimizing uh off of MMP even though the

24:16

data is the same you would say but somehow Firebase is uh is just performing slightly better and not 100 of keys but uh statistically wise that's what I've seen in my experience that was new to me that was cool one of the tips I got from somebody on on the podcast is if you want to Target because Google's very hard to Target right like if you want Target have the right keywords in your ad copy Google's smart enough to find the right people to match your ad copy to any tips on the creative side are you guys using a lot of videos I've seen like videos be okay you're using banner ads sex ads from the Google perspective the the thing with with Google it's it's fully automated and you can control anything about how how the distribution of of creatives will actually work and since we are managing a lot of UA and Google and in a lot of different titles we see there is a very varied distribution of spend between

25:13

games so some games have are more heavily on on search some games are more heavily on videos and display yeah and it's not something that we control can you tested out the vertical videos it doesn't matter what you put in it's it's like it's okay it's different between games it's interact different between yeah I know I know it's very ambiguous to an extent but still there are Trends right and uh we know for example what works best for YouTube If you want to get more YouTube inventory you can fit in uh longer duration videos they're going to have a higher chance pick up uh spend and pick up traction off of YouTube um a copy is extremely important because you know a lot of uh like the highest quality and usually the lowest CPI is actually coming from search uh part of uh Google inventory that is less controllable right but you still want to make sure that it's it's tuned properly and then static uh ads are a little bit

26:11

less impactful a little bit less impactful right but they still play a huge huge role in the in the search algorithm and also the white ad network of uh you know gdn traffic that Google has so yeah I would say like in in terms of the ranking video uh copy and then banners really okay we've got like three minutes left Rebecca and this is for everybody obviously but you're the closest what is the top marketing strategy or tactic you found the most effective this year tub marketing strategy or a tactic yeah can we narrow that down a little bit just in general top marketing yeah in general hmm I think that's what you meant right Emery I think that's what you meant [Laughter] um I'm gonna take that into the creative aspect I'm gonna funnel it down that way I think that um I know that ugc has been very popular recently and influencers have obviously been popular but I think the normal like and old way of creating

27:17

a video which is hook gameplay and call to action is still the winner of all ads and I think that creating different iterations where you're seeing different ways to do quality to actions different ways that you can like judge the players within their fake gameplay during the the middle segment of the creative has been really helpful um we have been experimenting I think it's also difficult because I think where we're trying to Pivot to grow our brand has less ability for tracking as we've mentioned before when it comes to influencers so one of the things that we're trying to do is have a better influencer program but at the same time I'm not sure if I can exactly say that that has been the most effective so far but it has been yeah it's definitely been what we have been focused on um so so I think ugc is is something that's that's been here for years um I think that we do see difference between I want to

28:15

say fake ugc that there are some platforms that that you can you know get in touch with influencers or actors that that uh simulate something that looks similar to the ugc in compared to actual uh being in touch with your players to engage them to create videos about your games and then make ads out of that yeah so we also found uh um success with that and another great strategy that I just want what about you margarita I can say a few I can speak of influencer marketing Focus uh Community marketing is a big Focus let's talk about that uh product marketing is a big Focus right talk about Community a bit too you want to expand on that yeah I mean I think uh Community is just so ingrained in the product and when our community is Happy our product is happy there was actually um a fun case study about a company that I thought was really interesting and it's not an app so I'm sorry about that

29:18

but um this it's from they're called from our place and they're like a cooking utensil company they grew their online community from like zero followers to like 600 000 followers in a couple years with um for my I think it's a correct no online advertisements and what they did their content strategy was not to shove the fact that they were trying to sell pans in your face but they instead made organic videos of cooking recipes and then collaborated with different chefs to make cooking recipes so they were like making content for Their audience that their people that these people would enjoy and then in the very middle of it was the product that they were selling and now they have like a brand partnership with Selena Gomez and even though this is like not an app I still think that that's like a learning that you can take into your own Community channels of how to create authentic engagement you want to add anything else

30:11

final words on the community aspect um I mean I probably not we're all we're all we're a time we're out of time okay look these Superstars are here they're available for selfies they're available for questions so if you need I didn't get to all the questions but thank you guys for submitting all those questions if you got anything just follow up them track them down or find me and I'll track them down for you one more time give it a round of applause for this battle a little bit more please come on all right thank you guys thank you guys thank you