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Does Spidey's Web-Swinging 'Make You Feel Like Spider-Man'?

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The bottom line

Spider-Man's web-swinging gives you the Spider-Man fantasy almost for free, while its combat makes you earn it. That was a deliberate choice for instant flow, but it leaves swinging with a low skill ceiling.

Key takeaways

Spider-Man's combat is earned, its swinging handed over
The same game sits at both ends: fights demand skill, while web-swinging feels like Spider-Man from the first press.
  • Games promise a fantasy, and the question is how easily it should come true. 0:25
    • Hitman's trailer shows a perfect assassin, but most first attempts go badly until you learn the level and master stealth.
    • Batman: Arkham's combat hands over the fantasy with tap-to-punch and generous counters, which can feel patronising.
  • Spider-Man's combat makes you earn the fantasy. 2:21
    • Spidey doesn't snap magnetically to enemies, and foes gang up on you, making dodges and counters harder.
    • Enemies shoot from afar and even attack mid-animation, so you look like a bumbling fool until you get good.
  • Web-swinging hands you the fantasy with very little effort. 3:43
    • You start a swing by holding R2 near any building, and air control lets you set up the next swing almost anywhere.
    • There is no fall damage, and hitting a skyscraper just turns into a wall run.
    • Most missions never ask for speed or precision, and one even stops you latching on to a helicopter until you've seen the explosions.
  • Other grappling games show that swinging can demand real skill. 7:00
    • Bionic Commando limits grapple points, so finding a route is a small puzzle and re-hooking in mid-air is a challenge.
    • Overwatch's Wrecking Ball swings like a heavy object on a rope and has no aim assist on the hook.
  • Insomniac kept swinging easy on purpose and put the skill in optional challenges. 11:13
    • Bryan Intihar says we didn't want to stop players, so the game keeps your momentum and flow going.
    • Bomb diffuser and drone chase challenges reward learned routes, though the point launch is often faster than swinging and the skill ceiling stays low.

Getting to live out the fantasy is actually a reward for being good at the game.

Game Maker's Toolkit

Chapter summaries

0:00 Games sell a fantasy, and Spider-Man's combat charges for it

Every big game promises a fantasy through its marketing, and Spider-Man's fighting asks for skill before it pays out.

  • Reviews praise Spider-Man for making you feel like Spider-Man, but that is what big games promise anyway. 0:08
    • Many reviews use that exact line.
    • Box art and E3 trailers set the promise.
    • Titanfall 2's trailer sells a nippy trickster soldier who hops over enemies, fools foes with gadgets and drops into a mech.
    • The gameplay then delivers that fantasy through its mechanics.
  • Spider-Man's fighting is Arkham-like but deeper and less forgiving. 2:21
    • It has many more moves and unlockable skills.
    • You can juggle enemies in the air.
    • The juggling is compared to Devil May Cry.
    • Arkham's Batman pirouettes between enemies like a goth ballerina.

3:19 Swinging looks perfect but asks very little

Every release point works, so swinging rewards little
Air control, zips and automatic wall runs mean a badly timed release costs almost nothing.

Web-swinging copies the films faithfully, and its tools make placing Spider-Man so easy that the game rewards little.

  • Swinging matches the movie look in every detail. 3:23
    • Animations, sound effects and sense of speed all fit.
    • Webs attach to buildings, not the sky.
    • New York's dense buildings mean a swing is available almost anywhere.
    • Letting go late on the down swing gives speed. Letting go on the way up gives height.
  • Extra traversal moves make positioning nearly effortless. 4:26
    • Web zip is a forward burst and a safety net.
    • Zip to point snaps you to any marked spot.
    • You can skip swinging and just chain zips, or steer like a drone.
    • Air tricks build focus and experience points.
  • Other games reward movement more and punish mistakes more. 5:03
    • Super Mario Odyssey demands precise routes, so success feels earned.
    • Sunset Overdrive and Superflight reward staying aloft or near walls.
    • Sunset Overdrive gives style points and safety from zombies for staying above ground.
    • Superflight's score ticks up while you hug a wall.
  • Few missions are about swinging, and the best ones are exceptions. 6:16
    • Scorpion infection mission: stay airborne because the floor is poisonous.
    • Electro fight: swing around buildings while shooting transformers.
    • Most missions are about beating up goons or rubbish stealth bits.
    • The player praises both swinging missions as awesome.

6:37 Other grappling games make the hook a skill

Limits and hazards turn grappling into a skill
Spider-ManBionic CommandoA Story About My Uncle
Grapple pointsAlmost any buildingSparse, aimed by cursorObjects in the level
Mid-air limitsNoneMust reconnect at right angleLimited grapples per flight
Cost of a mistakeWall run, no damageToxic goo, bottomless swampsFall short of landing
Player mustHold R2Solve a route puzzlePlan route before takeoff
Scarce grapple points, limited mid-air hooks and deadly ground make route planning part of the swing.

Swinging can be hard to learn when the game limits where and how often you can grapple.

  • Limits and hazards turn a swing into a route puzzle. 7:10
    • In Bionic Commando, toxic goo and bottomless swamps keep you off the ground.
    • A Story About My Uncle gives a limited number of mid-air grapples, so you plan the route before takeoff.
    • Enemy snipers in Bionic Commando force you to keep moving from point to point.
    • Moving objects in A Story About My Uncle act like a gravitational slingshot.
  • Other games make the swing itself a weapon or a trick chain. 8:28
    • Wrecking Ball damages foes it swings into. Spider-Man mostly keeps swinging and combat apart, until the Scorpion and Electro boss fight.
    • In The Free Ones, jump detaches the rope, so you chain pulls and springs in mid-air.
    • Its panel hook works like a Zelda hookshot.
    • Clicking panels at top speed is hard enough that a little slowdown would help.

9:38 Spider-Man's world limits what could change

Harder swinging is possible if it respects the movie fantasy, and earlier Spidey games tried small tweaks.

  • Copying those systems outright would break the fantasy. 9:41
    • Spidey has no finite webs that refill on landing.
    • Movie New York is a packed city, not a wasteland, and Peter Parker is lithe, not a 500 kilogram metal ball.
  • Earlier Spider-Man games and Sunset Overdrive offer subtler ideas. 10:14
    • The Amazing Spider-Man 2 fires webs from the left or right hand with the shoulder buttons, but air control makes it matter little.
    • In Ultimate Spider-Man, webs pull you toward the building, so you swing side to side with rhythm.
    • Sunset Overdrive has a combo system for fighting zombies while bouncing off car bonnets and grinding power cables.
    • Spider-Man could link swinging and combat that closely.

10:56 How hard the fantasy should be to earn

Depth was available, so the real question is how much work players will accept for the fantasy.

  • Optional depth over a simple core is a proven model. 12:01
    • Swinging could be as complex as Tony Hawk's combos, Mario Odyssey's hat-throw chains or Mirror's Edge speedrunning.
    • Mario Odyssey needs only simple jumps to finish, while advanced moves unlock secret coin stashes and level skips.
    • Those moves also help win later missions like the golden Koopa races.
    • Most buyers of a game called Spider-Man want to feel like him the second they press start.

In the growth library

Mark Brown, creator of Game Maker's Toolkit. Games promise a fantasy through their marketing, and the design question is how easily that fantasy should come true: handed over free, or earned through skill. Spider-Man's demanding combat versus its effortless web-swinging, and the grapple hooks of Bionic Commando, Overwatch and The Free Ones, show the options.

More from Game Maker's Toolkit · The whole library, and ask it anything

Transcript217 lines
0:00

It seems like the biggest compliment you can pay the new Spider-Man game on PlayStation 4, is that it makes you feel like Spider-Man. Seriously, there are loads of reviews that contain that exact same line. And what they mean is, if you’ve seen a Spider-Man film in the cinema, then you’ll have an idea of how Peter Parker moves, fights, and swings about - and playing the game will capture that exact sensation. But actually, a lot of games work like this.

0:27

Especially big console releases. Because games promise us a fantasy, and say, pop this in your Xbox and you’ll get to feel like an assassin. Or a World War 2 soldier. Or a cowboy. Only, the fantasy isn’t promised through a Hollywood movie, but instead the marketing for the game. Like the picture on the front of the box. Or those flashy CGI trailers they play at E3. For example, this Titanfall 2 video shows us the fantasy of being a nippy, trickster soldier who jumps over enemies, uses gadgets to fool his foes, and can jump into a big mech to wreck shop.

0:58

The gameplay then delivers on that fantasy, and effectively uses its mechanics to make you feel like the bloke on the box. But the question I want to ask is: how easily should that fantasy come true? Look at Hitman, for example. The CGI trailer shows Agent 47 as a perfect assassin. He kills his targets without ever being spotted and then escapes into the shadows. But boot up the game itself and most first attempts will see you screwing everything up like a big bald idiot.

1:26

It’s only when you learn the level, master the stealth system, and put in a bit of effort that you’ll be able to live out the fantasy promised by the game’s snazzy marketing campaign. And maybe that’s the right way to go, because if you give away that fantasy too easily it can ring a bit hollow. That’s what happened with the combat in the Batman: Arkham games. This is a really simple fighting system where you just need to tap the punch button over and over again, and Batman will magnetically snap to enemies, pirouetting all over the place like a goth ballerina.

1:56

And if you hit the counter button at any point during the generous timing window, the Dark Knight will deck his enemies with ease. Sure, fights look appropriately cinematic and the game makes you feel like Batman - but when you don’t have to exert all that much effort to get there, doesn’t it feel a bit patronising? This is not the case in the combat for Spider-Man, which has a lot in common with the Arkham fighting system but is a fair amount more demanding, and a lot less forgiving.

2:26

Spider-Man has lots more moves and unlockable skills, and can juggle enemies in the air like you’re playing Devil May Cry. Plus, Spidey doesn’t snap so magnetically to enemies when you punch. Enemies gang up on you, making dodges and counters harder to pull off. They use guns and rocket launchers to attack you from afar, or while juggling enemies. And they’ll even attack you when you’re in the middle of cool animations, like swinging bits of the scenery around.

2:47

All of this means that, for a while, you probably won’t feel all that much like Spider-Man. You’ll look like a bumbling fool, getting bonked on the head by street punks, fumbling finishing moves, and just sort of punching thin air. It’s only when you get better at the combat that you’ll actually be able to dance around goons like Spidey does in the movies. So the combat in this game doesn’t make you feel like Spider-Man - but it lets you feel like Spider-Man, if you’re skilled enough.

3:14

Getting to live out the fantasy is actually a reward for being good at the game. Web-swinging, however, is quite different. It is, to be fair, a pitch perfect recreation of the swinging you see in Spidey movies. Right down to the animations, to the sound effects, to sense of speed, to the fact that the webs actually connect to buildings instead of, like, the sky. It absolutely makes you feel like Spider-Man. And it’s just really satisfying to swing around the city.

3:43

But it also comes very easily. Starting a swing in Spider-Man is as simple as holding down R2 when you’re somewhat close to a building. Which, in the densely packed metropolis of New York City, is just about anywhere. You will then enter a swing, and and can choose when to let go: either when you’re just coming off the down swing if you want speed, or when you’re barreling up towards the sky if you want height. You can also jump out of the swing, with X, for more speed and height.

4:10

But it doesn’t matter too much when you exit the swing because you have so much control over Spider-Man in the air, that you can easily set-up the next swing to go anywhere. For example, if you whip the camera left, you can make a sharp turn and start swinging down a street to your left. There are also some other moves you can use while traversing. The web zip gives you a quick blast of forward momentum, and is a cheeky safety net if you end up in one of the few places without buildings.

4:33

Zip to point lets you snap onto any spot indicated by a circular symbol, and you can then leap off again with a well timed hit of the X button. And you can also do air tricks, to build focus and experience points. This whole system makes it almost effortless to put Spider-Man where you want him, either by abusing that ample air control to move Spidey around like a drone, or by forgoing web swinging altogether and just using the zip to point system.

4:58

And you can certainly read that as a positive. Or as the game making life just a bit too easy. It’s very different to, say, Super Mario Odyssey where getting Mario to the right spot means reading the level layout, chaining together the right actions, and moving with absolute precision. And because it’s quite tough, it’s immensely rewarding when you get it right. Spider-Man requires far less of the player, giving you a lot less satisfaction.

5:24

And even if you do screw up, the game is extremely forgiving. There’s no fall damage whatsoever, and no reward for staying in the air - unlike Insomniac’s last open world title, the spicy Sunset Overdrive, where you’re given style points and safety from zombies if you manage to stay above ground. There’s also no reward for getting close to buildings like in the addictive Superflight, where your score ticks up as long as you’re in spitting distance of a wall.

5:48

And if you hit into a skyscraper in Spider-Man, it’s no big deal. You don’t bonk off like in Mario Odyssey: you just instantly transition into a wall run. Which might slow you down, but not massively. And who really cares when the game so rarely asks you to swing with speed or with precision? You’re either just bumming around in the open world, or doing main missions that are so rarely about swinging: they’re much more often about beating up goons, or doing rubbish stealth bits.

6:16

Okay, okay, there are some good missions about swinging, like this stage where you’re infected by Scorpion and have to stay above ground at all times because Peter thinks the floor is poisonous. That’s an awesome mission. And in this fight against Electro, you’ll need to carefully swing around buildings while shooting at power transformers. I like that one too. But more often than not, missions will be like this one: where there’s no need to be fast and catch up to this helicopter quickly because the game won’t let you latch on until it’s made sure that you’ve seen these cool explosions first.

6:49

Now, it’s not impossible to make a game where web swinging is a bit more technical, requires a tad more thought, and isn’t quite so forgiving. Web swinging, after all, is basically just a grappling hook: a mechanic we’ve seen in lots of games, from Uncharted 4 to Titanfall 2, and so there are plenty of examples of games that have played with this mechanic. Take Bionic Commando, for example. This po-faced shooter is generally pretty dire but the grapple hook gameplay is surprisingly fun.

7:16

Like Spider-Man, you can hook onto buildings, and then swing off at the right time - but what makes this game more interesting, is that in this post apocalyptic wasteland, grapple points are much more limited. Meaning that finding a route across a level is a tiny puzzle you must solve, and reconnecting to grapple points in mid-air is an actual challenge. You’ve got to position yourself near to a viable point - as indicated by this cursor - and at the right angle to keep your momentum going.

7:42

Plus, toxic goo and bottomless swamps stop you from touching the ground, and certain hazards like enemy snipers force you to move quickly from point to point. Then, there’s Overwatch, where the recently added character Wrecking Ball - actually a hyper intelligent hamster in a robot orb - can use a grapple hook to latch onto bits of the environment and swing around. This one’s really interesting. You don’t have very much control over the ball when it’s swinging or in mid-air, because it actually acts like a heavy physics object attached by a rope.

8:11

So you’ve got to be much more precise about your speed, position and angle of the initial hook, to get where you need to go. Also, there’s zero automation on the grapple hook point. You’ve literally got to aim and shoot with a cursor, which makes latching on at speed, or in mid-air, a real challenge. And finally, as the character’s name implies, this hero becomes a literal wrecking ball when in motion and you can cause great damage to foes if you swing into them.

8:37

This is very different to Spider-Man, which often has a distinct divide between swinging and combat. Though, the boss battle with Scorpion and Electro finally lets you use both at once. I also enjoyed the first-person game A Story About My Uncle. In this one, a goofy magnetic glove pulls you towards objects, but can let go at any time to keep that momentum, and continue flying forward. This is especially fun with moving objects, that can really propel you like a graviational slingshot.

9:07

You also have a limited number of grapples in mid-air so you have to plan each landing carefully, and puzzle out your route before you take off. A subtly different take on this idea crops up in The Free Ones. I’m this game you can latch onto wooden panels, and drag yourself in, like a hookshot from the Zelda series. But at any time you can hit jump to detach your rope and spring yourself forward. Chaining together these moves in mid-air makes for some exhilarating gameplay.

9:33

Though, a little slowdown might be nice, when trying to click on those panels at top speed. Now these ideas might not work for Spider-Man. Spidey doesn’t have a finite number of webs that get replenished when he lands, like in A Story About My Uncle. The New York City we’ve seen in every Spidey movie is a tightly packed metropolis, not a ruined wasteland like in Bionic Commando. And Peter Parker is a lithe, athletic figure - not a 500 kilogram lump of metal like Wrecking Ball in Overwatch.

10:01

And so to go against those facts would, actually, break the fantasy that Spider-Man is promising. But I reckon there’s lots Spider-Man could have done to make web swinging more challenging, while still delivering the fantasy promised by all those movies. And other Spider-Man games have toyed with more technical web slinging. The Amazing Spider-Man 2 had a cool idea, to have webs come out of Spidey’s left and right hands, when you hit the left and right shoulder buttons.

10:25

It doesn’t really affect much - you have so much air-control that you can turn left even after swinging from the right - but that could be interesting to explore. And in Ultimate Spider-Man, webs draw Spidey closer to the building he latches onto, so you have to swing from side to side with a bit more rhythm to stay in the middle of the street. Again, it’s very subtle, but it’s something. Plus, Spider-Man could definitely integrate swinging and combat more closely, like Sunset Overdrive, which has a whole combo system that encourages you to fight zombies while bouncing off car bonnets and grinding on power cables.

10:56

At the end of the day though, it comes down to how much gamers want to work to fulfil their fantasy. Spider-Man’s web swinging could absolutely be as mechanically complex as keeping a combo going in Tony Hawk’s, or chaining jumps and hat throws in Mario Odyssey, or speed-running in Mirror’s Edge. But it’s clear that Insomniac wanted the system to be effortless to pick up, and the developer specifically chose to avoid things that would break your flow, saying...

11:20

BRYAN INTIHAR: “One thing we talked about is we didn’t want to stop players. We didn’t want to, like, face-plant. We wanted to just keep your momentum and flow going. He’s eight years being Spider-Man, he’s fine-tuned his traversal, so you slam into a building and you just keep running up it”. So perhaps Insomniac was right to keep the more technical side of web swinging to optional content, like these bomb diffuser challenges, where you’re graded on the time it takes you to get between different points.

11:45

Or these missions, where you chase a drone and have to swing through big blue targets. Your first go will be abysmal, just like a first stab at a Hitman mission. But learn the route, steer around buildings, and chain in different moves, and eventually you’ll score a gold medal and, yes, feel like Spider-Man. It’s similar to how Super Mario Odyssey works: you only need simple jumps to finish the game, but advanced manoeuvres will score you secret coin stashes, let you skip bits of the level, and help you win later missions like golden Koopa races.

12:14

Unfortunately, these Spidey sidequests will uncover how finicky the physics can be, and reveal how leapfrogging from building to building with the point launch is often much faster than normal swinging, and it will also show that the skill ceiling of the web swinging is still pretty low compared to other traversal based games. But it’s better than nowt. And, while I would have loved to see a more in-depth web-swinging system, similar to the stuff in Overwatch and The Free Ones, I guess if you buy a game called Spider-Man, most players just want to feel like Spider-Man the second they press start.

12:48

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